On Balance Feedback and Charge Changes
" @All I think this guy works for GGG !!! Having LESS opportunities gives you MORE opportunities . Forcing players . After beta PoE with a few skills and uniques gave you more interesting interactions than the shitload that are now in game . Almost every build use it so remove that thing . This really sounds like GGG talk to me. @Chris Nice words , but the facts matter . At least for ppl who have their brain and dignity intact . ( Cannot belive how many asslickers are there) | |
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I like the changes. If it were up to me i would nerf every single thing, every item and every skillgem from blade vortex to cleave just to get a semblance of the tactical gameplay poe had when it was young.
I wouldn't even call these changes a nerf. We need more drastic ones than these if you want to increase the difficulty in the main game. I'm a forum warrior, i was born to post, raised to defend my league. Now my post has been removed, chained and exiled by mods who Ban. Ban is my brother; i do not fear it. I see it in the eyes of men and beasts that i troll. It will take me to play the actual game when i am ready and i am not ready. Last edited by Pyrokar on Jul 28, 2017, 2:48:29 PM
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" I'll answer for him. Both your premises are incorrect. 1.You still can shock bosses with a 5%+ hit. The duration is increased, what changes is the effect value. This allows GGG to tweak numbers without killing builds that depend on the boolean ailment status (ie. "Life leech against Shocked enemies"). This is good. 2. The minimum debuff is 5% (not 4), and that's for builds not focused on this mechanic. If you build towards shock you'll have means to improve these values, as you should. You don't get that free cheap damage if it doesn't fit your build anymore. This is also good. And seriously, when you have a 2H sword Marauder cleaving and bleeding enemies out, then throwing an unsupported elemental trap to instantly cut bosses hp by one third, something's really wrong. | |
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Reddit - a land inhabited by hostile species who fling poo and spit acid.
GGG, dont worry too much about the reddit community. Take everything they say with a grain of salt. Just remember, many of them are/were secretly Diablo 3 players who are/were already filled with anger towards change. Since I am not playing the beta this round, I cannot provide proper feedback from the change, but at first glance and initial thoughts, I don't mind the changes at all. Main characters: Deep_water - AnomaIy - Artica
Build guides: https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1602863 |
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For charges, we have two different types of investment that builds can make to make use of them:
Passive Tree investment Charge Generation Investment Power Charge Change:
Spoiler
I suppose it's nice that power charges aren't just for crit anymore, but for attack based builds, we are spending two points on the tree, to get a power charge that gives us 30% crit, and no additional benefit. What it means, is that for optimization, we will instead choose to grab 1-point 20% nodes (nodes frequently left out today from many builds.) Doing so gives the attack build more per/point crit chance. From a generation standpoint, assuming the above, we would need to determine if it's worth it to even have a power charge generation solution in order to get 90% increased crit... That is 3-links that could be used elsewhere... but what for? We don't have any new utility skills that would complement a crit attacker, and a crit attacker usually doesn't need to have a clearing skill and a separate single target skill... most crit attackers aren't gem starved, so I think you may find these setups still exist, but we only generate the 3 chages. Net result? 60% less base crit chance (from the pcharges) + the delta from skill tree efficiency pickups. Call it 100% less crit chance when taken altogether? Now builds that NEEDED that pcharge for crit because they didn't have attack crit clusters nearby... those are gonna be a bit hurt. But right side tree crit should be okay still. All in all, except for specific unique mechanics that involve pcharge, or skills that utilize them, this isn't all that big a change. It's just a crit chance reduction for attack builds, crit chance reduction but more damage for spell builds. Verdict: Meh. Livable (if frenzy wasn't getting adjusted to not include spell dmg, then i'd have a problem adding another %more spell dmg source). Frenzy Change:
Spoiler
Bit of a kick in the teeth for spell casters, trappers, miners... Spell Raiders are just dead. Raider is built around Frenzy charges and this change makes a Spell-caster raider pretty inefficient... Trappers... oo boy. Traps aren't in the best place at the best of times, but that we have nodes for trap frenzy generation, plus a new unique for frenzy generat, but now i HAVE to use an attack trap to benefit from either (I assume that would work?)... That's... really crappy. Traps were already hurting from the change to the ailment double-dip... This is just salt in the wound, man. Now we're gonna be confined to skills that have innate gem-like mechanics or threshold jewels (Frost bolt miner which is effective 8 link with innate pierce, plus two jewels for example). So, no spell build would ever invest in frenzy charges on the tree now, and CERTAINLY wouldn't invest in charge generation (either from gear, skills, or Ascendancy Classes). That includes CoC Casters, Miners, Trappers, etc. And that would be fine... but there's no replacement for it! Yes, there is now more spell damage on pcharge, but bottom right casters are gonna be in a BAD spot to try to get to them. Plus where builds from that area could frequently use theme appropriate gear to generate frenzy charges, there isn't much theme appropriate ways to generate power charges, so we're talking curse setup changes... And if we lower right casters DO invest in pcharges (tree and generation)... well... why wouldn't we all just go crit now? I'm pathing out of my way for more dmg/crit nodes and picking up 3 of them, I'm getting 180% crit from that, and I've got crit near me anyway... If I'm gonna jump through hoops to make a lower right caster, I see NO reason to not go crit if I'm making a tree investment in pcharge... All in all frenzy charge change is super junky for build diversity... Verdict: WHYYY!!!?!?!?! Pls don't kill right-side casters, spell trappers, etc. Y U Do this? Chill/Shock:
Spoiler
.... this seems silly. As far as I can tell, this is just so that the latest spate of uniques that have "when chilled/shocked" effects get used? You think they're not getting used because ppl don't think the effect lasts long enough to benefit from them? They're not getting used because there are better options out there. This change won't change the fact that they're just not gonna be in super-wide use... Possibly while leveling and early maps? But it's not like we don't have options for that timeframe today... so.... WHY??? If instead this is to prevent fast hitting crit builds being able to apply status when there's really very little elemental damage being done... Doesn't that only matter for bosses? So wouldn't it be better to fine-tune the boss resistance to statuses? Verdict: If you're just trying to get us to use the awkward "when chilled" blah blah uniques... this ain't gonna do it... so... WHY? Last edited by prescben on Jul 28, 2017, 3:01:21 PM
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This post is going on 39 pages now, so I'll be honest and confess I haven't read all of it...
I read Chris' post and the following one about changes... My opinion/impression is that GGG is currently going on a warpath against what's fun and playable... You see, Shadow has 3 ascendancies and Assassin is fun and solid and versatile... The other 2 are useless, funless and a waste of space. Why don't you focus on making under used and under developed ascendancies better, rather than destroying what is viable, fun and popular? Each class has 3 ascendancies... Why haven't you checked the Stats for characters played for each ascendancy? It's easy to see that some ascendancies aren't played because they are useless! And besides, I have to confess that this game is starting to go down the same path as Diablo 3, in the sense that there seems to be a power creep that is tryong to settle down in our beloved game! Case in point, Legacy uniques. Pretty sure that sooner or later we're gonna start seeing "ancient" uniques and crap like that... Now returning to the Assassin nerf, and charges nerf... If you want build diversity, fix the broken ascendancies! Then people will start tinkering with those buffed ascendancies and new metas will appear! Path of Exile has room for everyone: hardcore players, filthy casuals and everyone in betweeen. But not if you start alienating everyone with baseless changes... This is my humble opinion as a casual PoE lover. Here since 2013 and hopefully for the long haul! GGG team, I sincerely hope you can find a way to get your vision out to us but without destroying what a lot of people see as essentials of exile. Warm regards to all the team, Manny |
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" I'm sorry Cris, i don't question your profesionalism, i even think this company has best feedback and communication i ever say in any game company ...and the content of your game is 100% solid ..who does the design and who ever put the base game mechanics in place is a genius ..but for the balance team? ..i just can't speak anything good about them ...there are unused trash skills like Power Siphon which never saw the light since 2013 ..and did nothing else but kill build diversity with senseless nerfs You received so much feedback because the community truly cares about this game, and the awesome mechanics that were put in place. But to see the logic of this new chill and shock balance changes where in order to apply a 30% chill on a boss you need to be able to kill it in 2 hits ..that is simply beyond me (and right after boss life receiving a significant boost too) | |
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I'm glad to see those changes. At last, they came out, they are logically correct and pc was buffed imo allowing more uniqs to be involved in mechanics. Only thing that is not good - deadly infusion nefr, imho it was way too deep nerf but I don't care about assassin much.
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Can you just for 1 patch. Not nerf anything. Take all the useless uniques, all the most unused ascendancies and all the most unused skills and just focus on buffing those. Every patch should actually put more options on the table. Can we just have one patch where the only objective is how do we make this better. Take the mountain of useless shit and just select a few to make interesting and useable again.
Just one time. Only focus on what to buff. What will enable more synergies. I want options. Not to be forced into playing one way for 3 months only to have that become dog shit 1 patch later. Last edited by Samson001 on Jul 28, 2017, 3:08:43 PM
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" I agree with you! |
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