Solo Self-Found Support in 2.6.0

I am pretty sure we are getting standard (permanent) SSF leagues too. Like, why not?

...but if not, I am the most disappointed player in the history of PoE. Definitely will quit, because I see no point playing other leagues with my limited playing time.

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elderwood wrote:

In fact, to me it would feel like being punished for not playing the 'proper' version of the game.

You are in fact being punished for not playing the 'proper' version of the game. But how is that any different than the way it is now? It is not punitive in the slightest bit so I see no reason to be upset that there are no increased drop rates. However I can understand why you want them.

As far as the permanent leagues go, I'm pretty sure SSF can be played in standard and hardcore. It wouldn't make sense if they dropped you out of SSF just because the league ended. Dropping you out of the parent league to standard though makes perfect sense. If this doesn't exist, I'd be very disappointed.

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Reizoko wrote:

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LMTR14 wrote:

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morbo wrote:

I'm surprised at the generally positive feedback for SSF and salute it. This thread is already the longest on the first page of dev manifesto subforum.

imagine an auction house thread...

ggg is kinda crafty in a way. they can keep features a lot of people have wanted for a long time in reserve, and only release them when something pisses off the playerbase (e.g. xbox version). if they would grant the players every wish right away, they wouldn't be able to counterbalance the negative impact unwanted (and mostly unneeded) changes have.

it's just like a band that reverts back to the old style that attracted the fans in the first place after a couple of sellout albums; or any kind of "tossing a bone" marketing strategy really. it may have been that in the beginning wilson and co actually had cared about making a good diablo 2-like game, but the reality is that now with 90+ employees it's long become a business, and nothing else.

grinding gear games exists for selling microtransactions to suckers, not for developing the best game possible. that is how business works. and the microsoft deal should have revealed that pretty obvious fact even to the most fanatic fanboys...

No, that is not how business works. In fact, it works the other way round. GGG has grown to 90+ employees BECAUSE they built a product that people want. Developing the best game possible is directly connected to selling more microtransactions. That's how business works.
You have to understand that your opinion about certain aspects of the game does not in any way represent the PoE player base as a whole. For every person that complains on the forums there are 100 people who don't share the same opinion.

no! there is no correlation between a good game and selling mtx. what you mean is a good PRODUCT. they want to create a PRODUCT that is as good as possible (just as e.g. blizzard wanted to do with diablo 3). big difference there. just think of hollywood movies and apply that principle to video games. do you think the latest avengers movie is made for creative reasons? LOL those aren't good movies. they are good products that can sell toys and cross-promotion

ggg has been disregarding players' interests for years now. and I don't mean the tiresome balancing issue, which for doesn't matter whatsoever. there are dozens of ease of use things alone, the horrible atlas screen where you barely can see the map that is highlighted, the for the longest time not searchable skill tree, the fact you still can't place items somewhere else on the sales screen after what is it not FIVE YEARS, the fact that the FILLER concept of temporary leagues has overstayed its welcome again FOR YEARS, the fact people need to use third-party tools to still get fucked in the ass by the clunkiest trading system I've seen in my life!!! or how about the "tiers" thing or the xp nerfs or the horribly unfinished act 4 or every other stupid choice ggg ever made. six acts instead of one GOOD act. LOL nobody wanted those changes, that was pretty obvious from the mood on the forums. or the very likely issue of us not getting ssf permanent leagues... the balancing is the LEAST of the problems (and it's yet what 99% of people complain about, horrendously missing the point)

or what about the player dropoff rate late in the leagues...

alas, the xbox version alone proves my point. they would have not made the choice to artifically hold the pc version back, conceptually if not technically, if they were so keen on "creating the best game ever"

sure, not all people want to see the same things implemented in the game. but nobody is actually hurt by e.g. a permanent ssf mode or an auction house. it doesn't replace the stone-age trading, does it?! a broad wealth of statistics that gives meaning to every character you ever created doesn't hurt the 1%? a permanent endgame with strategy elements (I call it "kingdoms") that everybody can partake in doesn't prevent you from grinding maps 24/7 if that is your thing?!?!?!? putting an * asterisk behind a reward mtx earned in SSF so you can brag that you earned it the hard way doesn't devalue the (in my eyes, dirty) mtx that people who bought the shaper "earned"?! I could go on here...

the dream is over. deal with it. or don't. ggg will still take your money if that is what you are about... and why wouldn't they? wilson is responsible for putting food on the table of 90+ people now. I can't fault him for trying to do that.

SSF sounds like a great idea, however, I do have a question about rare items. For example; I've never found a shav's in the 4(?) years I am playing. Will there be a system in place to grant access to build-defining uniques such as this? Of course I expect certain checks in place in order to not abuse this by transfering these to standard.

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Xewys wrote:

SSF sounds like a great idea, however, I do have a question about rare items. For example; I've never found a shav's in the 4(?) years I am playing. Will there be a system in place to grant access to build-defining uniques such as this? Of course I expect certain checks in place in order to not abuse this by transfering these to standard.

There is already a system in place for this, it's called divination cards.

I echo another poster's sentiments about have SSF available in standard as well. Since standard league isn't time dependent, this may be the most practical format for someone such as myself to utilize SSF. I like the concept and it would be a nice character to play in between leagues. I'm not sure how that would work (maybe its not even possible) as it would require a specific stash as well.

Thank you for including the option at least in leagues. I'll never begrudge a developer providing players with more options on how to play!

I would love to see a system to convert crafting orbs in SSF.
That would make the mode more dynamic imo.
Maybe trading with the masters but with a fair ratio ?

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ghoulavenger wrote:

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elderwood wrote:

In fact, to me it would feel like being punished for not playing the 'proper' version of the game.

You are in fact being punished for not playing the 'proper' version of the game.

This is the bit that I find problematic.

It's not like we are abusing the game in a way that wasn't intended. GGG have recognised that there is an audience for this type of mode, if not they wouldn't have bothered. However, feeling punished for taking advantage of the offered mode would surely risk alienating people? We are playing by choice, after all, and if they want the mode to be a success then they shouldn't be making us feel punished at all. I just think that if they are going the furnish us with a new mode, half measures seems a little weird.

I think all people that want to play this mode are asking for is a fair loot formula, one written for a single player experience. As I said, I'd be happy to have the mode locked off, so as not to wreck the wider economy.
I just want a a non-punitive RNG to keep thinks rolling along at a pace that is... fun.

I certainly don't want anything like 'easy mode'... if I wanted that, I'd play D3!

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elderwood wrote:

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ghoulavenger wrote:

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elderwood wrote:

In fact, to me it would feel like being punished for not playing the 'proper' version of the game.

You are in fact being punished for not playing the 'proper' version of the game.

This is the bit that I find problematic.

You took what you wanted and skipped the rest. The new SSF mode is not punitiive, because it is no worse than playing the regular game.

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elderwood wrote:

It's not like we are abusing the game in a way that wasn't intended. GGG have recognised that there is an audience for this type of mode, if not they wouldn't have bothered. However, feeling punished for taking advantage of the offered mode would surely risk alienating people? We are playing by choice, after all, and if they want the mode to be a success then they shouldn't be making us feel punished at all. I just think that if they are going the furnish us with a new mode, half measures seems a little weird.

I think all people that want to play this mode are asking for is a fair loot formula, one written for a single player experience. As I said, I'd be happy to have the mode locked off, so as not to wreck the wider economy.
I just want a a non-punitive RNG to keep thinks rolling along at a pace that is... fun.

I certainly don't want anything like 'easy mode'... if I wanted that, I'd play D3!

A few years back, I actually did want an SSF specific league with increased drops. If you asked me a year ago I might still have felt the same. Ask me today though and I'd say "We don't need increased drops, I mean two days ago I dropped six different uniques within an hour and I wasn't even trying to find uniques." Am I against increased drops? Only so long as there is an opt out option. Without the opt out option I'm on the fence, because some people actually enjoy the grind and I find that the game is perfectly playable without me trading.

Will I play the new SSF league? No, probably not. I've already got a lot of time invested into standard and they probably won't just dump my entire account in. Rightly so, as I've not always played SSF (and so can only claim mostly self found), and do occasionally party with a few pals.

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ghoulavenger wrote:

You took what you wanted and skipped the rest. The new SSF mode is not punitiive, because it is no worse than playing the regular game.

Of course I took what I wanted, I felt that was the part that I wanted to advance my point with ;)
We all do it, even you, I dare say. =)

Honestly, you and I could go toe to toe on this for months and we'll always find our differences. Same as any other two people. The destinction I wanted make was that the whole point of the SSF mode is that it's, by definition, not the 'regular game'.

All I was trying to say is that I feel there is a disparity between the playstyle & ethos of SSF and the RNG formula as it stands, and that I feel it jars slightly. That's all. This is a game after all, and I feel that, from my perspective, this change would make it more enjoyable without either hand-holding or punishment.

ARPG's are all about scarcity, of course they are. That's where the whole idea of loot hunting comes from. It's also the main draw for me to games like this. However, if the drop rates were not altered, to reflect the altering of the behviour in relation to trading, it would just feel like scarcity for scarcities sake and a punitive difficulty spike.
Grind for the sake of grind is, simply put, not fun.

I would just like them to balance the equation in accordance with the ethos of the mode, that's all. I simply wanted to air my view, so that if the Devs are reading, they can get as rounded a view of the community as possible. Varied voices etc.


And at the end of the day, this is only one man's opinion ;)