[HLD] Clever Construction

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lllllDethkloklllll wrote:

This feels a little too powerful in PvP atm. A trapper can throw traps all over the place which you cant see and also cant damage for 5 seconds. They can force you into a corner and throw traps at your feet until your dead and you have no way of clearing their traps because traps can not be damaged for 5 seconds after being thrown.

It seems like there should be a down side like traps can not be damaged for 5 seconds after being thrown and also can not detonate for 5 seconds. On smaller maps a trapper can just throw traps all the way from their side of the map to yours back you into a corner and kill you. Theres no way for you to avoid their damage unless you kill them at range before they get to you. This makes trappers really weak against ranged characters and really strong against melee. Maybe we can give trappers something that helps them with ranged characters while making clever construction easier to deal with as a melee character.

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lllllDethkloklllll wrote:

Mulla you've got some sort of victim complex going on here. Please find a single post of mine where I say any of the things you've just wrote. If your so amazing why didn't you alpha test? Why are there no new threads from you now that the patch has dropped? You could simply make a singular thread to house all of your ideas and complaints and continue bumping it but you'd rather go into people's thread who agree with you and stink up the place with your whining. You took the time to write your QQ post... there wasn't anything constructive you could have added to my OP?

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hauntworld1 wrote:

if you remove clever construction then traps are fucking useless.

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MullaXul wrote:

My 2cents on Clever Construction would be to reduce the invincibility time from 5seconds to 3. Its excessive at the moment but its a requirement for traps/mines to be viable in high end pvp. So you cant butcher this keystone, you just need to reduce its active time 2-3 seconds from 5 to 3 or maybe even 2. You just need to get the traps out, not have them instantly destroyed. After that traps are pretty much fine. People should know matches vs trappers/miners should be played within line of sight anyways to see anything they do. They should be aware of the fact they must have something to clean the floor to approach safely. 2-3Sec Clever Construction, things would be fine for both parties.

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InsaneWallaby wrote:

I'd agree on this thought about traps. As a casual, they've killed my desire to PvP.

Simply playing in the Sarn arena, a random guy and I were chasing one another. We were relatively evenly matched, so it was fun.

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lllllDethkloklllll wrote:

I played a good 10 or so matches against Hege last night with my 1h character. I will say 1h characters have a much easier time dealing with traps than 2h mainly because of Whirling bladed vs Leap slam for movement. Anyways I got Rekt in all of our matches I either never killed him or got 1 kill at best in a round. He offered some suggestions which I tried out but ultimately the best thing a 1h melee character can do is throw bear traps in from of them everywhere they walk to set off other traps. A lot of our matches ended in a draw or me getting rekt in the first 20 seconds because I stepped somewhere wrong or got bear trapped in a corner and couldnt use WB to move fast enough.

One thing that could be interesting to try would be if traps could be damaged before they land with CC. So if someone is throwing traps at you you could spam cyclone or Molten strike to break them before they hit you but if your too slow and the trap lands you cant damage it for the duration of CC.

Heres the situation that made me think of this.

Your melee and you walk onto a bear trap because shit happens.... You get hit by something that chills you and also temp chains so now your really slow.... Your in a hallway that zig zags so movement with wb is going to take a while. Traps are flying at you which deal aoe damage so all the trap has to do is get close enough to go off and your going to get hit.

The above scenario sucks as melee you only have so many flasks to be able to escape something like this and even then once your hit with bear trap your stuck until it runs out using WB in a hallway is about as good as standing still. Add to this that traps deal a lot of damage 2-3 fire traps from hege will take out 10k es even running POF I even went so far as to equip ROTP with POF for 83 fire res and 7kes but the damage is still too much to survive 3 hits in a row.

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hauntworld1 wrote:

if you remove clever construction then traps are fucking useless.

Not a single person in this thread has asked for the removal of clever construction. Everyone has said it needs an adjustment. If you feel it needs no adjustment then please state why so we can get a good discussion on the topic going.

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MullaXul wrote:

My 2cents on Clever Construction would be to reduce the invincibility time from 5seconds to 3. Its excessive at the moment but its a requirement for traps/mines to be viable in high end pvp. So you cant butcher this keystone, you just need to reduce its active time 2-3 seconds from 5 to 3 or maybe even 2. You just need to get the traps out, not have them instantly destroyed. After that traps are pretty much fine. People should know matches vs trappers/miners should be played within line of sight anyways to see anything they do. They should be aware of the fact they must have something to clean the floor to approach safely. 2-3Sec Clever Construction, things would be fine for both parties.

Agreed I think dropping CC down to 3 seconds just for PvP should be tested... 5 seconds immunity per trap in a match that only lasts 1:30 is a really long time.

Also there needs to be an animation when traps are destroyed. I was clearing traps with RoA last night even though I knew I hit the traps I couldnt see them break apart which made me question if I had actually hit them or not. Id run by the spot and wouldnt get hit so I knew I cleared the traps but having it be a guessing game isnt right. This was vs a puncture trapper not hege

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InsaneWallaby wrote:

I'd agree on this thought about traps. As a casual, they've killed my desire to PvP.

Simply playing in the Sarn arena, a random guy and I were chasing one another. We were relatively evenly matched, so it was fun.

Yea that can definitely kill the fun in the arena when a couple of people are throwing traps all around and then hide in a corner getting free kills. Im not sure how to solve that problem though seems like anything you could do would make trappers usless in the arena.

As for giving something to trappers in exchange for tweaking CC MAYBE a flare type trap that would deploy something to intercept projectiles. Give it a good cool down so it cant be spammed and this would give trappers the ability to get in range to hit a bow character without getting instantly killed by puncture TS or EA.

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andkamen wrote:

Spoiler

that somewhat unnecessary large quote

herald of thunder is great vs non clever construction traps but also repeatedly zaps the CC one untill it breaks them. If its not hitting anything around you it means you are safe.

It also zaps them mid air if they are non cc.