PvP exclusive characters

I do not expect this to happen. But....

it makes sense to me.

So here is the idea. You make a new character and select "PvP league". This creates a character completely outside of the regular POE PvE game. In this area, you create your build. You are given the appropriate amount of passive points. You are allowed to "create your own items". Yes, this means you make the best items (level appropriate) with the modifiers you want.

Is this not the only way to have a truly fair PvP experience?

For starters, PvP balance becomes much easier. Everything is in a different league. All gems can show the actual PvP values. PvE becomes a non-factor. The items and gems never cross leagues. Everything is PvP exclusive and can be balanced as such while being very translucent to the player. This opens up PvP only uniques, just like descent had it's own uniques.

Anyone can jump into PvP. Casual players will have instant access to the same gear as the hardcore players. A person playing the game for the very first time, has the opportunity to be competitive. Hardcore PvP players have the opportunity to make any build they desire.

This is skill based PvP.

*Edit* I believe I may be seen as being too negative. So, I would like to add in an amendment. I would like to suggest that if we can't come up with a fair and competitive environment, that we should instead focus on quality of life improvements. Things like cross-realm ques. Grace periods so people can cast auras or swap gems. A forfeit command. Some sort of knowledge base where PvP modifiers are made public. The Dream: the ability to que up for PvP while playing PvE.

Too much work. PvM and PvP go hand in hand with the end result being you work for your character. A new league isn't worth it for the <100 people that actually pvp, maybe less that that honestly that I can recall by name/character.

Go play Guild Wars if that's what you are interested in.

AaRPG Pvp will never be fair to casual, that's what keep it interesting. You know that you can grind, get better gear, reach better tiers, try to be the best. It's an awesome feeling to realize that all this pve grind and theorycrafting are worth something.

Obivously this game is biased because of legacy and mirrored items but i'm fine whit that (except for Legacy Kaom wich is a huge advantage), I know what tier i belong and that i'll never have the possibility to invest enought time to reach the top players gear. Denying that would be denying the game and it's crafting system.

Wanna play a skilled pvp game, go play CS:GO or Dota2, this is never gonna happen in PoE. The best we can expect is to get some balance around skill who are definitely superior to others but otherwise, a player who invested time in his character should be rewarded.

"

IceDeal wrote:

Go play Guild Wars if that's what you are interested in.

AaRPG Pvp will never be fair to casual, that's what keep it interesting. You know that you can grind, get better gear, reach better tiers, try to be the best. It's an awesome feeling to realize that all this pve grind and theorycrafting are worth something.

Obivously this game is biased because of legacy and mirrored items but i'm fine whit that (except for Legacy Kaom wich is a huge advantage), I know what tier i belong and that i'll never have the possibility to invest enought time to reach the top players gear. Denying that would be denying the game and it's crafting system.

Wanna play a skilled pvp game, go play CS:GO or Dota2, this is never gonna happen in PoE. The best we can expect is to get some balance around skill who are definitely superior to others but otherwise, a player who invested time in his character should be rewarded.

Ha legacy kaoms is the least advantageous most overrated item in PvP and pvm.

"

MullaXul wrote:

"

IceDeal wrote:

Go play Guild Wars if that's what you are interested in.

AaRPG Pvp will never be fair to casual, that's what keep it interesting. You know that you can grind, get better gear, reach better tiers, try to be the best. It's an awesome feeling to realize that all this pve grind and theorycrafting are worth something.

Obivously this game is biased because of legacy and mirrored items but i'm fine whit that (except for Legacy Kaom wich is a huge advantage), I know what tier i belong and that i'll never have the possibility to invest enought time to reach the top players gear. Denying that would be denying the game and it's crafting system.

Wanna play a skilled pvp game, go play CS:GO or Dota2, this is never gonna happen in PoE. The best we can expect is to get some balance around skill who are definitely superior to others but otherwise, a player who invested time in his character should be rewarded.

Ha legacy kaoms is the least advantageous most overrated item in PvP and pvm.

Lol, legacy kaoms is better than alot of chests yes, but 6k vs 10k hp wont matter, a 1shot will still 1shot you

Would be more like 6k vs 9k. On average legacy kaoms is about 3000 HP with the current %hp nodes. So still 1shot is 1shot and a regular kaoms is about 1500hp over a regular chest depending on tree. While its already been proven belly of the beast > new kaoms plus gets a shield. Not to mention es has a higher effective "life" rating then anything legacy kaoms will do for you. Talking 8-12k+ with a shield on es.

"

IceDeal wrote:

Go play Guild Wars if that's what you are interested in.

AaRPG Pvp will never be fair to casual, that's what keep it interesting. You know that you can grind, get better gear, reach better tiers, try to be the best. It's an awesome feeling to realize that all this pve grind and theorycrafting are worth something.

Obivously this game is biased because of legacy and mirrored items but i'm fine whit that (except for Legacy Kaom wich is a huge advantage), I know what tier i belong and that i'll never have the possibility to invest enought time to reach the top players gear. Denying that would be denying the game and it's crafting system.

Wanna play a skilled pvp game, go play CS:GO or Dota2, this is never gonna happen in PoE. The best we can expect is to get some balance around skill who are definitely superior to others but otherwise, a player who invested time in his character should be rewarded.

I am responding to the bolded sections.

So the rich get richer? Anyone that already has mirrored and op legacy items are now rewarded? I understood going in that PvP would be largely gear based. However, games like Diablo did not make ladders, seasons, rewards (for PvP).

What is the point in balancing skills? We as players have no clue how they are balanced. We look at a skill gem and it says the exact same thing in PvE and PvP. What happens when you spend months on a build, eternals, mirrors, exalts; then your build is "balanced"? How is that rewarding?
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Call me crazy, but GGG is severely overestimating the popularity of PvP. They have said nothing new about PvP. It will be exactly as it is now. Joe Casual will que up for this "new" PvP system. Get destroyed by the same "less than 100" people that currently PvP. Then go back to PvE. If you don't like PvP now, I see no changes that would make you want to PvP in official seasons.

"

Opinionated wrote:

I am responding to the bolded sections.

So the rich get richer? Anyone that already has mirrored and op legacy items are now rewarded? I understood going in that PvP would be largely gear based. However, games like Diablo did not make ladders, seasons, rewards (for PvP).

What is the point in balancing skills? We as players have no clue how they are balanced. We look at a skill gem and it says the exact same thing in PvE and PvP. What happens when you spend months on a build, eternals, mirrors, exalts; then your build is "balanced"? How is that rewarding?
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Call me crazy, but GGG is severely overestimating the popularity of PvP. They have said nothing new about PvP. It will be exactly as it is now. Joe Casual will que up for this "new" PvP system. Get destroyed by the same "less than 100" people that currently PvP. Then go back to PvE. If you don't like PvP now, I see no changes that would make you want to PvP in official seasons.

These issues will become apparent pretty quickly once the pvp events start. Chris said in that pvp announcement thread they're willing to make pvp gear more accessible though, so we just have to wait and see how far they take that. Hopefully the majority of players will agree that pvp should be all about player skill and not at all about who farmed more for gear.

"

MullaXul wrote:

Ha legacy kaoms is the least advantageous most overrated item in PvP and pvm.

Ok so this as nothing to do with the current subject but, just to be curious, wich chest are you using ?

"

am responding to the bolded sections.

So the rich get richer? Anyone that already has mirrored and op legacy items are now rewarded? I understood going in that PvP would be largely gear based. However, games like Diablo did not make ladders, seasons, rewards (for PvP).

What is the point in balancing skills? We as players have no clue how they are balanced. We look at a skill gem and it says the exact same thing in PvE and PvP. What happens when you spend months on a build, eternals, mirrors, exalts; then your build is "balanced"? How is that rewarding?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Call me crazy, but GGG is severely overestimating the popularity of PvP. They have said nothing new about PvP. It will be exactly as it is now. Joe Casual will que up for this "new" PvP system. Get destroyed by the same "less than 100" people that currently PvP. Then go back to PvE. If you don't like PvP now, I see no changes that would make you want to PvP in official seasons.

Well unfortunately for me this kind of pvp will never be balanced. If you give everyone access to top gear, people gonna loose interested. i'm gonna quote the villain of The incredible here 'When everyone is super, nobody are".

The main problem is that the gap between OP gear and regular one is just insane. Crafting a GG weapon take so long that i'm still wondering how people managed to do it without using deviant ways (and i'm playing since the beginning of Open Beta).

I've played Diablo 2 for a REALLY long time (since release until Ubers) and was a big fan of pvp (played mostly ww-ssin). It was possible for a regular player to get access to really good gear by grind, be proud of it and compete with everyone. Here the gap between is jut too big.

I have ton of fun with Tiers2 pvp players, everyone got a shot at each other and i'm sur we're all having a blast but as soon as one of the top dogs are coming, they are just crushing everyone without any possibility to counter them (and it's normal, if they take ages to craft their gear and grind their level, they should be as powerfull as they are). But I'm pretty sur it's boring for them as well not having more opponents (There is probably around 10-15 peoples dominating the top HLVL pvp scene) and always playing the same peoples.

I'm sur people like Tommie or Mulla ,who can insta rape the whole sarn arena, would be very happy to have more competitions. Problem is, most player never gonna cross the gap between Tier2 and Tier1. I consider myself a pretty serious player (i play around 3-4 hours a day, sometimes more) but thing like Loath Bane or Glyph Mark are totally out of my reach. What about people who play even less ?
So it's no surprise that top players get bored and leave the game, who would like to play against the same 10 personns for ever or crush ants for fun.

PS : Sorry for the bad english, it's obviously not my first language.

I use legacy kaoms because I got it for 24exalts in beta. Could I afford one now no? Would I use a new Kaoms and have 1500 less life exactly and still have the same results + 40% more fire damage? Yes...I would and wouldn't even mind if that became the case. BUT, at the moment I have a legacy Kaoms and its absofuckinglutely counter productive for me to down grade. Lastly Kaoms equipped players hp ratings are a joke compared to ES equipped characters. I wont get into it but think about it for a second and think about the current and probably forever consistent state of pvp. Where life regeneration is = to es regeneration in the same hit and run scenario. Yet head to head tank vs tank it comes down to effective hp/es vs damage/defense options and speed and which one has it all with no sacrifice of another?