0.2.1 Temporal Chains maps and possible solutions

Context

I've just run 2 Temporal Chains maps after getting the 0.2.1 patch. Threw 4 characters at those maps to see how various builds handle it. Some anecdotes from that:

A Snipe character wants to be looking at the edge of the screen often. When the enemies are close, then I'll be doing something else but when I know the enemies are far away, my eyes are in Snipe mode. I'm putting down slows far away so melee enemies are harmless. Ranged attacks usually have a projectile that my eye can follow back to see if I need to get out of the way. The few "curse style" spells (no projectile, just spawn an AoE on a timer) are used by specific monsters that I know to watch out for, doing a well-telegraphed casting animation. Corpse explosion has the decency of glowing very brightly to telegraph (I know that was rather recently added in PoE 1 before EA).

The cursed maps have no telegraphing from the edge of the screen. You must look at the center of the screen to have enough time to react. Many times I missed my Snipe timing window because I got slowed while I was looking at distant enemies. You don't look or listen for the cues of when the perfect window is, you memorise it. Even if I do spot the curse on time, while I'm channeling I have to roll to abort - and the curse AoE is so wide there's no guarantee I can get out from just one roll. The slow at the end of a roll means I don't have time to walk out. Consider the wall case: curse spawns with no gap to the wall, enemies are hemming me in, forcing me to run more or less the entire diameter of the circle to escape. Of course, once you get cursed by temporal chains once, it's much harder to get away from further curses.

My Snipe character's alt mode is Elemental Sundering. There's no time to build up frenzy charges when slowed so much. No time to get the many elemental afflictions going. In theory I can swap out gems for Rake + Rain of Arrows but this again doesn't feel great.

My monk relies on Shattering Palm and (optionally targetting Glacial Wall) to dash around at will. This doesn't help as much as it seems in cursed maps. I don't have time to cast the wall then dash before the curse gets off, not when I'm mid-attack. Dashing towards the enemy doesn't guarantee escaping the circle either if the RNG happens to place it inconveniently. This can be extrapolated to Ball Lightninng and Lightning Warp too: it's unlikely the caster will have the right conditions to get away from a ground curse by using this.

Worst is when you get caught in the curse, kill the last mob and now have to walk around with the 20 second slow. Or when you sit around waiting for it to expire before starting some extra content like Ritual or Breach. Jumping to town and back gets rid of it but when the portal animation is also slowed, this doesn't feel like a solution. I suppose logging out is better but it's kinda absurd that this is the counterplay.

Still, arguably this manageable when you have lots of space to run around in. Then you enter a Ritual that's spawning Volatile Plants. Now it's hell: limited space, purple orbs that don't trigger on palm dashing through them, enemies you have no time to attack because otherwise orbs and random curses will get you. Then a rare spawns with temporal bubble just to spite you.

I tried throwing a minions witch into that. Doesn't help, the 14 skeletons I have out don't stop the purple orbs, they get slowed by the curses too, minion respawn timer is increased by the curse and like Snipe mode, my eyes are at the edge of the screen because I'm using Command skills (and flame wall, etc). Just to add insult to injury, I can't distinguish between my own Temporal Chains casts and the map mod's. My witch's alt mode is Dark Effigy with Temporal Chains so I'm dissuaded from getting that sequence of skills going.

My tactician was doing ok if only because shockburst rounds clears fast. Thankfully storm lance timers weren't affected by the curse and I'm pinning everything by default anyway. Even so, he was lucky. Thunderous leap's movement animation and leaping animation get desync'd when cursed. Meaning I move fast to the endpoint then hang in the air, unable to move for some time. Plenty time for a purple orb to blow up.

Possible solutions

In PoE 1, you had tools to mitigate curses:
- getting curse effect down (flasks, gear, etc)
- holy flame totem to cancel it
- Warding flasks to remove it

In the absence of such tools in PoE 2, if temporal chains maps must remain then I suggest:
- reduce curse duration to 3 seconds: enough to potentially kill in the moment, gone when the danger is absent
- make the curse circle glow and make sounds: distinguishes it from player casting and telegraphs when eyes are focussed on the screen edge
- make the circles slightly smaller or increase activation delay

Better than temporal chains would be a petrification cursed ground: think of the PoE 1 basilisk that takes time to slow then petrify you. The player is given time to react. Again there'd need to be about 2.5 seconds 'grace period' before the player is punished with the full petrify debuff. That gives time to get out of the way.

More elegant than "some circle just spawns on the ground" would be if a percentage of monster attacks got buffed to apply the curse. So the monsters have a chance (rolled per attack) for a ~20% slower swing with a weapon effect (the microtransaction store has plenty) to telegraph. If the player fails to block, evade, roll, etc that telegraphed swing, then they get cursed (for some 3 seconds).

Conclusion

Overall the change from permanent-curse to situational-curse is a step in the right direction. It just happened to be a step into a pothole. The concept has merit: force the player to change their plans more often. In 0.2.1, this concept is implemented too crudely for me to engage with temporal chains maps. Not unless I have a build specifically to deal with these maps and I don't think I'll be bringing another character to maps before 0.3 happens.

My problem with the new Curse implementation is that it's making maps a lagfest. Revert this constant ground casting GGG

game already slow, no need for further slowing

there are too many negative affixes on waystones that add zero fun to the game

"

Schverika#2698 wrote:

Context
In PoE 1, you had tools to mitigate curses:
- getting curse effect down (flasks, gear, etc)
- holy flame totem to cancel it
- Warding flasks to remove it

I think this is the big hole. If you cause the player new problems, there has to be a way to solve the problems. In PoE1, with Pantheon and gear, I can get curse percentage down to 0. I take a DPS hit, so I don't wear that gear all the time. It's like putting on a space suit.

If there's no way to do that in PoE2, that seems like a high priority.

Just wondering, but instead of writing an essay could you maybe try Wanderlust boots? Honest question, does it help?

"

plz#2115 wrote:

maybe try Wanderlust boots? Honest question, does it help?

Someone with Wanderlust should answer that one. Relying on a unique to drop first, even a low level one, isn't a great solution.

"

Glowie_Zigger#5018 wrote:

sacrificing a gear slot to negate 1 single mechanic is kind of a shit design space, dont you think?

No. You can always spend some chaos to reroll the waystone. Or just don't run it if it's corrupted. The idea is to set a variety of challenges to the player. The player then chooses which challenges to accept. If it's possible to do everything with the same set of gear, the game is shallow, and ultimately uninteresting.

"

DistributedAutomaton#5739 wrote:

If there's no way to do that in PoE2, that seems like a high priority.

They just added a chest rune that gives 40% Curse effect reduction: "Craiceann's Rune of Warding". There are many sources of Reduced Slowing Potency but for some reason, certain slows are immune to this effect.

edit: and yes Wanderlust works on Temporal Chains/Chilled Ground. Its a fine counter to those map suffixes. My issue with the new curses is that they have needlessly generate more terrain clutter.

"

LeFlesh#9979 wrote:

"

DistributedAutomaton#5739 wrote:

If there's no way to do that in PoE2, that seems like a high priority.

They just added a chest rune that gives 40% Curse effect reduction: "Craiceann's Rune of Warding". There are many sources of Reduced Slowing Potency but for some reason, certain slows are immune to this effect.

edit: and yes Wanderlust works on Temporal Chains/Chilled Ground. Its a fine counter to those map suffixes. My issue with the new curses is that they have needlessly generate more terrain clutter.

Then what are people complaining about? JFC. I agree with your concern about terrain clutter.

"

DistributedAutomaton#5739 wrote:

"

LeFlesh#9979 wrote:

"

DistributedAutomaton#5739 wrote:

If there's no way to do that in PoE2, that seems like a high priority.

They just added a chest rune that gives 40% Curse effect reduction: "Craiceann's Rune of Warding".

Then what are people complaining about? JFC. I agree with your concern about terrain clutter.

Trying to figure out the design intent. They could have just added the Warding rune and called it a day, but they changed Temporal Chains maps from permanent curse to theoretically-situational depending on player skill. That suggests they want players to attempt Temporal Chains maps before they've acquired all the countermeasures. This thread is pointing out they may have overtuned the difficulty (and sheer annoyance) of this optional challenge.